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Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 8:25 am
by Gisela Grell
Hi all,

Dana, stingrays are amazing! I love to snorkel with them. Well, the first time I was scared because they come very close but to watch them while moving through the water is so impressing. Don't change beaches, just go to the big bay. They are only at the smal bay in Castara. 8)

Mikael, unfortunately we will not be there at the same time but as I go back again and again we will probably meet one day for stingray watching and a Carib or two. :lol:

Roland, thanks for this statement. In fact until now I never thought about getting attacked by a stingray. I keep my distance and just watch.
And beware of the falling coconuts :wink:

Cheers
Gisela (7 days to go) \:D/

Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 11:10 am
by Emma D
Hi there,

I would warn that stingrays are found in big bay, I've seen them many times (I'm not trying to put anyone off, rather make sure nobody gets an unpleasant surprise!). They come in to feed in the shallows. However they are unlikely to want to get close to humans so my advice is (if you are nervous of them) to just stay still until they pass to limit distressing them. I can't believe that tails are being cut off these beautiful creatures because people do not understand them. Humans are more troublesome than any other animal!

Enjoy :D

Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 12:07 pm
by Steve Wooler
Hello Emma

Please don't take this the wrong way, but may I take issue with your wording "I would warn that stingrays are found....".

IMHO there is absolutely no reasons to 'warn'. I would say that those lovely friendly beach dogs and cats are MANY times more dangerous than the rays. If you chase any animal and force your attention on it you are asking for trouble. If you allow that creature to come to you, then surely it is indicative that it is happy to make contact? None of these creatures are aggressive except possibly when threatened.

As you say, rays are found in both Castara bays. I took the shots below (general view and enlargement) from the hillside at the western end of the big bay last March. The rays actually seem to enjoy humans. Although you might not see or be aware of them, they often swim close to people splashing about in the water and seem to like watching them.

I have never heard of a death caused by a stingray other than the Australian idiot. Having seen one or two of his programs, I am inclined to believe he was probably in very close contact and taunting the ray. I have heard the very occasional report of rays sleeping on the sandy bottom, in very shallow water, and swimmers getting a lacerated foot when the ray bolts after they stand on the tail, but I've never actually met anyone who knows of such an incident, so I believe it might be one of those dangers that have happened once or twice around the world and which have passed into folklore.

Image
Image

Talking of contact with sea creatures, may I bore you with a true story that happened to me many years ago in Hawaii.

We were staying at a beachside hotel with huge landlocked salt-water lagoon behind. There were four or five dolphins in the lagoon. They had all been rescued after being hit by speedboats and other vessels. Although fully/largely recovered, they were considered dangerous and there were signs all around the lagoon warning visitors not to swim in the water, feed or attempt to make contact with the dolphins.

Like many people, I feel a huge empathy for dolphins and it was the first time in my life that I had come close to one. I felt a desperate need to make contact, despite the warnings. I sat on a small jetty out into the lake/lagoon and started patting the water. After 5 minutes or so of doing this, one of the dolphins several hundred metres out gave signs of hearing and being interested.

I sat there for ages, patting the water with my hands or feet. The dolphin got closer and closer and within an hour was swimming within 10 metres of where I was sitting. Within two hours, it was swimming below me, allowing me to run my hand over its head and body as it swam past the jetty. A crowd gathered and someone alerted the beach guards. One came over and told me it was dangerous and that people had been badly bitten by them.

The crowds made me feel self-conscious so I left. However, I went back early next morning. Within five minutes of starting the patting the dolphin was back. Within an hour he was sticking his snout up onto the jetty (about a foot above the water level) and allowing me to stroke him. My, what a mouthful of teeth they have. I understand the concern.

We were only there for about four days but by the end of the second day that dolphin would come the moment I patted the water. Other people saw me and tried it. The dolphin would come in relatively close to shore but never approached them. I spent most of my time on the jetty. I sat there dangling my legs into the water and eventually the dolphin would rest its head on my lap, just like a dog. Neither of us like having other people around and the dolphin would swim off the moment they came onto the jetty, although there were always people watching from the shore.

Eventually, some guy came along, brushed past me, sat on the end of the jetty and started patting the water. To my amazement, the dolphin swam up to him, stuck its head out of the water and, as he reached forward to touch it, lunged forward and bit him. It was only a nip but it drew blood. He shot off like a scalded cat. The dolphin just swam in a circle and returned to me. After seeing what had happed, I was a bit nervous, but it just swam straight up to me, stuck it head out of the water and put it on the decking right next to me.

I was frankly too choked to speak. It still brings tears to my eyes remembering that incident. The actions of that wonderful creature speak volumes. Make of the facts what you will – but I know what I believe the dolphin was saying and nobody will convince me otherwise.

So, treat these creatures with respect and I firmly believe that respect will be reciprocated.

Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 12:27 pm
by Emma D
Hi there Steve,

I agree, I worded that incorrectly. As an animal biologist I certainly feel there would be no danger in getting close to a ray. However I just wanted to highlight that they are indeed found in big bay and didn't want anyone to falsely think they could swim without encountering one - I can appreciate people have certain fears (I myself am not big on spiders!).

What a lovely encounter you had with the dolphin, thank you for sharing that. I think it illustrates your point perfectly.

Best wishes

Emma

P.S Great photo!

Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 1:34 pm
by Mikael A
Nice pictures aswhell steve, And a very intresting history about dolphins. Says it all in my opion.

Tho i get abit sad when i see u call the tv-personalty like steve irwin a idoit after so much he have done for animals, in all kinds. Sure enough he doesnt follow all the rules layied out, or act in a proper way at all times.

But making the rest off the world that never would give a *** about the nature, now very intrested and actully in manny cases protective about our nature. Is in my opion deserved our greates respect and nothing els.

Mikael A

Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 1:43 pm
by Gill M
Hi Steve

Many thanks for sharing those beautiful photographs - amazing as was your story of the dolphin - a wonderful memory never to be forgotten.

Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 2:35 pm
by Steve Wooler
Hello Mikael

Let's not get into argument about Irwin. The world is totally divided in opinion about him. All I can say is that he gave me the creeps since the first time I set eyes upon him on TV and nothing I have seen or heard since has persuaded me that he deserves any accolades. We will never know the truth, but the circumstances of his death only proves the point. Anyway, Irwin is strictly off-topic as far as Tobago is concerned, so let's leave him to the Aussies.

Posted: Fri Sep 22, 2006 6:52 pm
by Paul Williams
Some very interesting points on this thread and I also did not like the way Steve Irwin "proacted" with animals.
Most of you will know that I am a total Castaraphile but I need to point out that not everything is rosy when it comes to the stingrays.
When we were there in April two incidents really upset us.
A young Swedish guy who wanted to take a lot of photos of the rays was really harrassed by some local teenagers and they took a lot of pleasure in chasing them off using sticks etc and when the guy asked them to stop he was given a lot of hassle by a guy who seems to think he is the fishermans spokesman he is also the person who has a go at people who photo or film the seine netting even though he does not do much pulling in of the net himself.
Also on our last day their were 2 rays that were brought in in the seine net and the fishermen did not put them back but just let them die on the beach.
We have to remember that Castara is still a genuine fishing village and not a resort and sometimes you will see things that can upset you.
Regards
Paul

Posted: Sat Sep 23, 2006 12:42 am
by Paul Tallet
The first time I met one of the Castara Sting Rays it frightened the life out of me ... they are really big and the experience of having something about 9 feet wide by 9 feet long (plus a tail) pass under you within inches of your face for the first time whilst snorkelling is a surreal and scary moment.

You also see the tail and you see the barbs that can harm you ... the barbs are about 12 inches long on the largest Sting Rays.

Many fishermen have told me how they treat these creatures with caution if they are brought in with the nets ... and particular on a boat ... many boats have returned with the barbs embedded in their hulls.

But Sting Rays are the most docile of creatures ... they will never attack ... they only defend themselves when trodden on or when people interfere with them and cause them traumas.

Whilst I appreciate the Crocodile Hunter is astute in his dealings with wildlife and deserves some credit for the good things he has done ... I have a sense that he was trying to do the same tricks with Sting Rays as he does with Crocodiles.

Sting Rays are not very good shots which is why so few people die from a direct hit in the chest ... it was unlucky ... but these creatures are never aggressive.

You can watch them and swim with them in Castara and they are beautiful and will never harm you.

But if you try to interfere with them or trap them then they will instinctively try to defend themselves ... just like any other animal and just like us humans.

There is no way that the Sting Ray that attacked the Crocodile Hunter did it without good reason ... and despite all his good work I hope that this incident does not in any way tarnish the good graces that we have (until now) attributed to these lovely animals.

Regards

Posted: Sat Sep 23, 2006 1:04 am
by D. Gould
okay . . . maybe i will go in for the stingray experience. you can bet your bottom dollar that i won't be interfering with them. i will give them their space, and hope that none come close and touch me. they just look scary, nature gave them that barb for a reason, and i just want to steer clear of it. i have swam with the fishes in t&t, but never rays. i don't stay in the water with jellyfish either. i give them their space, as i am the outsider. i guess castara people are immune to their presence.

i don't condone harming them however. they are not bothering anyone, they have to be in the sea, bathers do not. if you don't like them leave the beach. there have been reports of violence against rays since the croc hunter's death, that is senseless.

i will have to play it by ear, and see how i feel when i see one. if i am too frightened, i will leave the water. i don't want the little flappers to sense my fear and attack me. paranoia! i would love to swim with dolphins though, they seem like such wonderful creatures. i grew up watching flipper, and loved him.

Posted: Sat Sep 23, 2006 8:44 am
by Steve Wooler
Hi D

I hear what you are saying, but nature often gives animal the weapons to defend themselves - not for aggressive purposes. The same could be said of dolphin - just do a Google image search for "dolphin teeth" and you will see some pictures of their teeth - but what a different perception we have of them. As Paul just said, they are the most docile of creature - but that is what would make them a huge prey to other sea creatures if they didn't have any means of defending themselves.

Posted: Sat Sep 23, 2006 8:57 pm
by Gisela Grell
Hi all stingray lovers and stingray scared,

first of all I have to apologize (especially at Dana). I never saw stingrays in big bay so I thought they never go there. My fault.

Steve, the photos are amazing, may I take one of it to my hompage, please? What a huge one! And the story about dophines tells a lot about this creatures. Thank you for sharing it with us.

Paul, how horrible to let the rays die in the sand. If I was there I would have gone crazy about this! Maybe we have to make it more clear for the people (especially the fisherman) that people come to see the stingrays swimming and that this is a part of the business. I'll do my best when I go there.

I like the word Castaraphile. I'm one of those also.

See you all there hopefully one day

Cheers

Gisela (5 days to go)
a.k.a. Shorty

Posted: Sat Sep 23, 2006 10:20 pm
by Brian Taylor
I guess the fishermen would not like it much if you tell them anything. they are a bit stubborn you know, and it id a fishing village in the first place. :?
I have never seen them leave the rays on the beach. usually they struggle hard to bring them out of the nets and back into the water. maybe these ones have been in their nets a few times and they felt it does not make sense to try again.
there are many more rays in the bay then you would think, they just never show up all at once. still I am sorry to hear about them beeng left to die. maybe it would help to offer them help to put them back in :wink:

amazing pics, steve, and a great story. I too feel that animals know who truly likes and respects them and behave different towards these people. so you are the "flipper-whisperer" then :D

sunny greetings
STEPHANIE

Posted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 10:11 am
by Gisela Grell
Hi Steph,

you are right again. I think I will stop talking about things I have no idea off. :oops: I just couldn't igmagine they let the rays die on the beach.
And surely the fisherman wouldn't listen to me. Even not for a case of Carib or two :wink:

Keep the sun shinig. I'm on my way

Cheers

stupid Gisela (4 days to go)

Posted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 10:19 am
by Steve Wooler
Hi Gisela

Thank you - and of course you can use them on your website (with acknowledgement of source, please). Just let me know if you want copies of the original shots - although the copies on the forum above are all you will need for web use.