Pigeon Point

Linda P · Post by **Linda P** » Tue Apr 27, 2004 10:10 pm

Has anyone been to Pigeon Point recently? what is the situation like there now?

Thanks

Linda

Steve Roughley · Post by **Steve Roughley** » Wed Apr 28, 2004 8:19 am

Hi Linda, we were at Pigeon Point the week before last, you still have to pay to get onto the beach TT$ 18 per person, it was'nt too busy and it is a lovely beach, you could get snacks and drinks, you had to pay for the loungers but if you take towels there will be plenty of room on the beach, hope this helps,

Steve & Hilary

Linda P · Post by **Linda P** » Wed Apr 28, 2004 2:33 pm

Thanks again Steve! I'll just have to ask you directly next time I have a question!

Linda

Katie · Post by **Katie** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 7:16 am

whats the point of paying to get on abech when there all around you for free!

Steve Roughley · Post by **Steve Roughley** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 7:59 am

We thought that the small charge was'nt prohibitve and it is such a lovely beach, i believe that the charge has come about because of the new owners, it was also within walking distance of our hotel, which was another good reason !

Steve & Hilary

Post by **Steve Wooler** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 8:56 am

Hi All

I think Linda was probably referring to the political issues at Pigeon Point.

Things seem to have died down a little, Linda. The matter hasn't been resolved. The THA say they are going to buy it through compulsory purchase order, but they haven't got the money. To be honest with you, I'm not convinced that being run by a government department would be an ideal scenario either. I have no objection to being charged to enter, as long as this magnificent peninsula is preserved and given the respect it deserves and that free access is allowed to the local population. Sadly, that is not the case under current ownership/management.

Fortunately, visitors who care about Tobago have avoided the place like the plague. It is now largely the preserve of package holiday visitors who are unaware of the controversy and by visiting cruise ship visitors, who are shipped in by the bus load turning the peninsula into the worst of the Mediterranean. Fortunately there are few cruise ships, so that’s not an everyday occurrence.

The management of the land appear to be responding to negative public comment and toning down their heavy-handed confrontational attitudes. The guards apparently don’t patrol in squads any longer, but are a lot more discreet. Some people have no trouble when taking photographs, but others have allegedly been treated quite roughly. I get the impression that it depends upon appearance – if you are wearing nothing but bathing gear and holding a tiny “domestic” camera, you’re ok; if you have a shirt and trousers on and something that looks like a “proper” camera, you could be in trouble. Of course you still have to wear those atrocious armbands (allegedly the cause of allergic reaction in a few people).

I obviously won’t go near the place, so can’t comment from personal experience. However, I’m told that they’ve chopped down a large number of the palms along the front – palms that gave the place so much character. I’ve been told that this was done because the palms were dangerous. I would accept this normally, but sadly from what little I know of those involved at Pigeon Point, I would imagine that there was an ulterior motive. When I think back to how beautiful that peninsula was back in the 50s and 60s, I could weep at the destruction.

Marc Jones · Post by **Marc Jones** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 9:55 am

Despite it being the picture postcard beach that you show people who have no idea of Tobago (ie "here is where I am off to", I'll not be going there.

Doesn't sit with my political and moral values.

Solidarity!

Steve Roughley · Post by **Steve Roughley** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 12:33 pm

Sorry !, we did'nt realise the situation and if we had we would have avoided the place like the plague, i obviously had'nt read all the information about it on this site, if we go back to Tobago we will give Pigeon Point a miss.

Steve & Hilary

Post by **Steve Wooler** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 1:04 pm

Steve - my apologies if my response made me sound critical of visitors who go there, particularly of those who go there not knowing the score. With over 80,000 words (???) of information on the main myTobago site, it's hardly surprising that a large percentage of readers have not read the comments in our Beaches section or on other sites.

I confess that it is a subject that does get me going. I was lucky enough to see Tobago before even Trinidadians thought of the island as a holiday destination. I wept when I saw the destruction to Buccoo Reef twenty-odd years ago. If I had my way, the entire sea frontage from Pigeon Point peninsula, through the Bon Accord Lagoon, to Booby Point at Buccoo, and all of Buccoo Bay including the Nylon Pool and Buccoo Reef, would be made a strictly controlled National Park. The Buccoo Reef Trust should be put in charge and given the powers and resources to restrict and control all traffic in the area, both on and off shore. Yes, make a charge for entry, by all means, just so long as different rates apply to locals and non-residents, reflecting the difference in wage levels, and as long as the money is ploughed back into preserving and restoring the ecology of the area.

Taking it a stage further, I would do exactly the same with Man 'O War Bay. I would love to see the entire bay and shoreline, right the way up to the ridge of the hills surrounding the bay and Charlotteville village itself, made into a national park with strict control over development.

These treasures of Tobago must be preserved and not squandered to the short-term financial gain of a few individuals. Thank God that most of the area around Charlotteville is still in the hands of the Turpin family, who care passionately for the area.

Steve Roughley · Post by **Steve Roughley** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 1:17 pm

Steve, no apologies needed, it amazes me how much information is held on this site, i will read everything before our next visit !

Steve & Hilary

Bryn · Post by **Bryn** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 9:28 pm

For those who aren't aware of the Pigeon Point Fiasco......please go back and look at previous posts to educate yourselves about what's been happening at Pigeon Point. It's not in my political, moral or ethical beliefs to go there either. We won't be when we go in a few weeks. If I wanted to go to Club Med then I would go. Arm bands on the beach? guards with weapons? no pictures to be taken? pay to enter? NOPE! Not me! Not my idea of a nice day at the beach. I could go on and on.....but it's not for me to make up your mind to go .....or not to go. I would just respectfully ask that you educate yourselves on the issue......and choose not to go.

Tobago is indeed Paradise as I know it......Pigeon Point is the downfall of my Paradise.

Bryn

Katie · Post by **Katie** » Mon May 03, 2004 6:16 pm

i totally agree with bryn go and find a secret bit of heaven some where else and you don't have to pay and can take as many photos as you like

J. Tomasulo · Post by **J. Tomasulo** » Sat May 08, 2004 3:08 pm

Hello. Just to add a bit to this subject, I was in Tobago for just over a month in Mar/April and was not aware of the Pigeon Point situation. I talked to many locals during my stay and not one mentioned the situation which I found odd. I wanted to visited Pigeon Point since my place was so close, but when I found out that you had to pay, I said screw it. If it's a thing of nature, you shouldn't have to pay. That's what the locals say. I didn't pay for any of those kinds of things including an Argyle Falls visit.

Now, my girlfriend ended up coming down to visit for a couple of weeks and we decided (after hearing it was possible) to walk along the beach to Pigeon Point avoiding the security gate. Apparently, you can walk along the beach and bathe in the beach, you just can't use any of the facilities. What I found odd and extremely humourous is the fact that we couldn't spend our money at the beach without a wrist band. I was so thirsty that I asked the guy beside if he minded grabbing a drink for me which he gladly did. Now that I think of it, I don't think it was a good idea.

The beach (water) is quite nice there. You can walk out so far with the water up to you waist which is awesome. There are so many other beautiful beaches in Tobago that it's no biggie if you don't go to this one.

My recommendation is to take a boat tour and check out all the secluded beaches. In my opinion, they are the true paradise beaches!

JT

Alan Cb · Post by **Alan Cb** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 3:49 am

I spent one week in Tobago in Feb 2002 with my family, and we went to Pigeon Point most days. We thoroughly enjoyed ourselves, and at no time did we experience any hassles or unpleasantness from, or in any way feel threatened by, the staff or guards, or harassed by vendors, and we did not experience any problems taking photographs. Therefore, it was to my great surprise that I read the anti-Pigeon Point sentiments in the Pigeon Point Forum, and other Forums of this website.

As far as I'm aware, an entrance fee has always been charged, not just by the current owners, but also by the 2 previous owners, and I really don't think that TT$ 18/ person (GBP 1.60) is exhorbitant.

The only difference that we found, compared to visits under the previous owners, was a vast improvement in the bar and eating facilities, with the addition of a proper restaurant, and even a roti hut, the availabilty of beach loungers for rental, and a new, well-paved access road, and some attractive landscaping. Also, if you like windsurfing, there are excellent windsurfing facilities on the Point.

In my opinion, the swimming there is the best in Tobago - you can wade or swim out a couple hundred meters to where boats are moored, and stand in crystal clear water. When we tired of swimming and playing in the water, it was back to the beach to slake our thirst and mellow out with a beastly cold Stag or Carib, and then to top it off, a roti for lunch.

We certainly were not the only ones enjoying Pigeon Point - there were between 20 - 40 others, also lapping it up, Italians, Germans, French , British, North American and Trinis.

Although the situation might possibly have changed since Feb 2002, my advice to anyone going to Tobago, is do not be put off going to Pigeon Point by all the negative comments on this otherwise excellent website. Go there with an open mind and positive attitude, to enjoy yourself, and not with a negative, suspicious, antagonist towards the people who work there.

Alan CB

Steve Fifield · Post by **Steve Fifield** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 7:28 am

I also visited in Jan 2002, 2003 and 2004, and can verify that it has gone downhill considerbly. On our last visit, we could not get food at the restaurant (along with many other frustrated visitors) because they had 'run out'. It was only 12:30, and they seemed to think that it was funny, rather than doing something about it. I really hope that they are under new management now.

On the beach, I also ended up arguing with the guy who drives the tractor to load up the beach loungers. It had been mixed weather, and had rained at about 3:00PM, so at 3:30PM when most visitors had left, he decided to clear up all of the loungers on the beach. He drove the noisy truck back and forth for nearly an hour, between my family and the sea, completely spoiling the (now sunny) afternoon that we had fully paid in full for, air thick with diesel fumes.

The sea grape trees have mostly gone, as have many of the palms, and the atmosphere is a little tense. The staff are often rude, and always try to give you a broken sun lounger first, as they find it harder to palm these off!

Besides all of that, I will return in 2005 (though only for the odd day). Why? Because there is nothing quite like it for kids, as it is protected by the coral from big waves, and it does have facilities like toilets and food etc. Most of the toilets are closed by 4:00PM though now, as they prefer to clean them up early ready for the next day. This is typical, the staff do what is convenient for themselves rather than their paying visitors, and then wonder why numbers are steadily declining.

Steve F.

Post by **Steve Wooler** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 7:39 am

Hi Alan

So, having paid your entrance fee, you are quite happy with a situation that effectively bans local Tobagonians from beaches to which they have a legal right of entry? You are happy with policies that have already led to the killing of one man? You are happy with a situation that led to the bulldozing of the original thatched pier, the removal of most of the Seagrape and palms along the beach front. You are happy with the razor wire fences?

Do you honestly think that the views expressed here and elsewhere on the Internet are really about something as trivial as entrance fees? With respect, that is an extremely naïve perspective. Personally, I welcome entrance charges to any/every beach if the money so raised is used to preserve the ecology of the area and/or provide better facilities for users. And provided that it is not used to exclude local Tobagonians who have a right to those beaches.

I won’t bore you with the details, there’s quite enough out there about it if you’re interested. The whole situation at Pigeon Point brings great shame on Trinidad & Tobago and I don’t propose to spend my time embarrassing the island further. Hopefully the matter will soon be resolved. The government have now agreed a deal to purchase the Point and hopefully once the deal has gone through, sanity will prevail. I confess to very great reserve about allowing the place to be run by any government body, but anybody has got to be better than the current aggressive, confrontational incumbents.

Enough said. I will make no further comment on the subject.

Marc Jones · Post by **Marc Jones** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:22 am

Steve Fifield wrote: ...there is nothing quite like it for kids, as it is protected by the coral from big waves, and it does have facilities like toilets and food etc.

Anyone help me with a beach like this elsewhere on Tobago?

I'm really asking if nearby PP is similar or have they fenced off all such beach?

I avoided PP last visit and won't pay this time either, but it meant I also missed Bucco Reef etc (also through fear of damaging the reef). I'd like to at least float past on a tour by a reliable and trustworthy guide - I'm certainly not interested in being anything less than a responsible eco-tourist!

Steve Fifield · Post by **Steve Fifield** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:31 am

Marc,

The Coral at Arnos Vale hotel is much better than anything you will see from a boat trip at Buccoo, and free of charge. For kids I recommend Canoe Bay, for a beautiful beach, try Castara, also with excellent snorkelling. For convenience (to Crown Point) the beach opposite the Seahorse Inn at StoneHaven is an excellent compromise, with good facilities.

Steve F.

Alan Cb · Post by **Alan Cb** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:42 am

Hi Steve

As far as I am aware there is no ban, only an entrance fee. Furthermore, even though there is an entrance fee, everyone has the legal right walk along the beach to Pigeon Point to swim there, although not use the facilities. Have done it myself, but it's pretty pointless when you wan't something to eat or drink.

The killing of the man was a great tragedy, and no one is happy about that, but obviously it could not have been the intention of Pigeon Point Beach.

As far as I am aware, the bulldozing of the thatched pier was not done by Pigeon Beach Club.

Of course I am not happy with the removal of the sea grapes and palms along the beach, if that is what has been done, or the razor wire fences. Can't say that I noticed either in Feb 2002.

I mentioned the entrance fee, simply because some members of these forums seemed to think that it is a big deal.

If anyone thinks that the purchase, or acquisition, by the THA / Government, will improve Pigeon Point, don't hold your breath. You just have to see what has happened to Maracas Bay in Trinidad (at one time the most beautiful beach in T&T - including Pigeon Point), to see what can happen when a Government/ Goverment Agency is responsible for beach facilities. At best it will probably end up like the Crown Point Beach area. Can't wait to see what they do with it. In fact, that is a very good reason to enjoy Pigeon Point now.

I think that any shame and embarrassment caused to Trinidad & Tobago, is being perpetuated by those who continue to make an issue of it.

I repeat, I did not find the present incumbents to be aggressive or confrontational, but maybe that was because I paid the entrance fee to use the facilities.

Marc Jones · Post by **Marc Jones** » Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:45 am

Sorry, should have added some more info!

We did Arnos Vale twice, but on the first visit it was too choppy to swim.

Canoe Bay we found covered in seaweed (plus you pay for the privilege).

Castara we did miss out, and will make sure we hit it this time.

Sorry for not being specific, I was trying to get assurance that missing PP and Bucco wasn't such a bad thing IYSWIM!